Worried about hormone imbalance

[Andy S]

So, I've been worried recently that I may have a hormone imbalance.  When I was younger I was way overweight, and now I'm at a much healthier weight.  My doctors told me I pretty much can't lose any more weight, as in pounds.  I still carry body fat in "warning sign" areas, especially my upper thighs, chest, and lower stomach. 

I eat pretty well these days, and workout alot, mostly kettlebells...but I'm definitely stuck in motion at the moment.  My one conclusion would be that my hormones are off track and preventing me from getting healthier.  I was a vegan for 4 or so years when I was younger.  During that time I ate terribly.  Almost exclusively, artificial food, ie: soy products, and rarely vegetables, and fruit.  To be fair, I was 14-18... I didn't know better.  I feel like that may be the cause by which I'm paying for now.  I'm 20 now, and a male, and recently went back to eating meat with hopes of getting more lean protein in my diet.

I take a maca supplement which was suggested by an alternative nutritionist, but I haven't noticed any change from that.  My question I guess would be, where to go from here.  Should I get a hormone blood test?  If so, who does that, general doctor?  Should I try the AED diet (I read the book) or at least take DN anti-estrogenic supplements?

Any advice is appreciated!

[erinmett]

Try AED!!!

[TheUsurper]

I honestly don't know too much about this topic, i must confess, but i would recommend just to use fairly common sense and do the following:
1) get your bloodwork tested asap by a general doctor if you feel there is something wrong with you, imbalanced, or deficient.  You may want to test it several times (and at different times of the day) over a couple weeks if the doctors don't already make you do this because testosterone levels and gh levels are known to swing wildly.  One test might put you in the barely "ok" range, while the majority of the time your body could be producing much lower levels.
2) slowly start modifying your diet.  You don't need to jump into the deep end right away and buy all the supplements and whatnot.  I would recommend, however, that you do pick up a copy of the anti-estrogenic diet book so you can have a guide to use as far as what needs to be removed from your diet, and how to prepare for a detoxification period, which you probably want to try.  You need to (eventually, but as quick as possible) remove all the processed/packaged/hazard foods from your kitchen if you really want to do something to change your life, not just follow a diet for a bit and expect magic to happen.
  Just for some more suggestions based on what I DO know, the idea that lean meat will magically make you the hulk is a myth.  I am about your same age man, and I follow a primarily lacto-ovo-vegetarian diet.  In case you didn't know, that just means that I eat mostly vegetables/nuts and eggs or dairy(mostly organic yogurt) as my sources of protein.  What you have to do to get your body to perform at it's most efficient is to supply it with ALL of the vitamins and minerals it needs.  Things like iron, copper(which helps with iron absorbtion), vitamin D, zinc, magnesium (and much more) are DIRECTLY related to your hormone production and blood health.  What is truly crucial, as far as macro-nutrients are concerned, is your fat intake.  You need to lower your carbohydrate intake on most days and consume mostly saturated and mono-unsaturated fats.  Hormones thrive in a fat-fuel environment.
      My typical fat-day meal looks like this: Large spinach salad with other raw veggies(bell pepper, few carrots, onion, celery), vegetable stir-fry with lots of different color veggies and 2 tbsp olive oil, 10-12 WHOLE eggs(usually soft-boiled, but occasionally over-easy or scrambled when the mood strikes), and 1-2 handfuls of raw almonds.  Furthermore, and some could say it's all in my head or something, but I really feel like my libido is a thousand times greater on these fat-fuel days than after my carb days.  After a large carbohydrate meal, I feel bloated and I just want to go to bed.  Some may be concerned about the large cholesterol intake, but really the cholesterol/saturated fat scare is primarily a myth.  Your body (in the liver) produces far more cholesterol than you can ingest.  Cholesterol is converted to sex hormones, which can help lower your bad cholesterol(obviously, because the cholesterol is no longer a cholesterol molecule, its been converted to a hormone), so removing cholesterol from your diet would be a bad idea.  Excess triglycerides are the real culprit i keep finding everywhere i turn.  I guarantee if you follow the AED to a T, you will feel like a million bucks during/after your fat fuel week from the lack of insulin and triglycerides clogging your arteries.
  Just remember a few things: diet will have a greater influence on your body composition AND how you feel than any supplement.  You may just be extremely sensitive to estrogen, or insensitive to testosterone.  If so, you really need to take care to protect yourself from environmental factors and do things like buy organic, filter tap water, and avoid plastics.  If there is a serious issue because you damaged your system beyond repair, and you do need to take drugs, remember that they only fix the symptoms, they do not fix the source of the problem.  Fructose(sugar in fruit) is the primary fuel for sperm cells as well, so make sure you get adequate servings of fruit on a regular basis, without over doing it(high in carbs in general).  Try to get like 2 servings a day, like 1 citrus and 1 of berries during the undereating phase.  Work out with HIGH INTENSITY.  Keep up with the kettlebells and try to incorporate compound lifts with heavy weights and short rest and intervals.  Don't workout more than 30-45 minutes, and don't work out more than 5 times a week, you will deplete hormones and over-stress your adrenals.  I use to feel the same way you do now when I was following a primarily high-carbohydrate diet.  I was always questioning if something was wrong with my hormones because my sex-drive felt much lower and I was getter fatter, even though I was training like a mad-man.  Many people will get to this point and say screw it, I'll just take some synthetic hormone boosters because I'm following "the right advice" and its not working for me, and not look at themselves for the root of the problem.  I'm happy to say that I went the complete opposite route and have constantly analyzed how the human body functions and went to great lengths to acquire all the knowledge I possess and for it, I'm about 6% bf, stronger than I've ever been, and libido feels great, all-naturally.  I hope this information helps you as well to accomplish your own goals.

[ELLA]

Usurper even though I didn't ask the question I would like to thank  you for your detailed answers on this forum.

I have been following the AE diet for over a week now and already feel ....well its hard to describe really ....I suppose I feel more alert /less foggy. I have been using the AE mainly for hormonal reasons. I am in the pre menopause years and finding it hard to function. This way of eating is really helping. The amount of fresh fruit and vegetables etc and lack of processed food must be doing my body good. I have lost alot of the desire for snack foods and even last night my husband was eating Pringles and drinking beer and I didn't feel the need for what he was eating. To eat a box of pringles in the past was the norm for me!!!
Anyways my question is with regard to hormone balance. Is milk thistle safe to use for women with estrogen imbalance. I have seen it mentioned on this web site but it never got a real answer. I have read online that milk thistle might be highly estrogenic and should be avoided. This concerns me as it is recommended as a supplement on the AE diet.

Thanks for your thoughts on this

Ella

[TheUsurper]

From what I've heard, milk thistle helps the liver by stimulating the growth of new liver cells, and serves as a powerful anti-oxidant.  Supposedly it also stimulates the production of your body's own anti-oxidants as  well.  I read that it helps to block the absorption of other toxins as well in the liver, but it makes you wonder though what medium.  It could be possible that it mimics these toxins by blocking receptors on the liver cells.  I've never heard that it was estrogenic though, in fact, quite the opposite.  I know a few bodybuilders who use it after using a hormone supplement to help detoxify and counteract estrogen rebound.  I dont like prescribing a supplement to anyone, but you have to see for yourself.  I don't imagine it being dangerous in the recommended amounts, as I've never heard of milk thistle poisoning before haha.  If you find yourself feeling incredible and stronger and more alert, I imagine it's helping.  If you feeling moody and groggy, you should stop.  If there is absolutely no change after taking it for a few weeks, see what happens when you stop.  I would try to get as many professional opinions as possible as well.

And you are most welcome, I love to help others out whenever I can, but I would have to say that diet is my "specialty" haha.  I'm glad to hear that you are doing well on the AED and hope you continue to find more strength and keep improving your condition.  Best of luck

PS- this website may help
http://www.drhoffman.com/page.cfm/183

[clake16]

I would also like to thank you Usurper.  You've made a lot of my info searching A LOT easier.

Some questions I have would be the menu that you posted.  I found that I LOVE soft boiled eggs as well.  Do you generally eat that everyday (every high fat day?)  I was just under the impression that I should vary my main protien source.  I have no problem eating mostly eggs - I would actually like it, but I just wanted to make sure that's safe/will get good results from it.

Do you ever poach eggs?  I've been trying to find a method that works, but I've had no luck.  Also, have you found a secret to peeling soft boiled eggs?  I love them after boiling for about 2-3 minutes, but then I find that it's VERY tough to peel them without damaging them or ruining them to the point of throwing them away.

Thanks,
Chris

P.S. what do you use as protien for your high-carb days.  I'm thinking of trying out mostly beans/letnils and possibly mixing in some eggs there as well.

[fotakou]

clake
from my experience it seems that water poached eggs with as many yolks as you want are the best form for eating eggs.they are pretty easy to make.you take a frying pan,put enough water in it,start warming the water and then put the eggs while trying not to break the yolk because it can get messy.Then you will notice that the white becomes "white".take a spoon and start throwing some of the warm water on the whites and yolks and after a while they will be ready for eating

[clake16]

clake
from my experience it seems that water poached eggs with as many yolks as you want are the best form for eating eggs.they are pretty easy to make.you take a frying pan,put enough water in it,start warming the water and then put the eggs while trying not to break the yolk because it can get messy.Then you will notice that the white becomes "white".take a spoon and start throwing some of the warm water on the whites and yolks and after a while they will be ready for eating

Thanks ..... I'll give that a try tonight.

[fotakou]

also look at my thread for the nut butter recipe

[Andy S]

Thanks for the responses.  A couple of things:  I went back to eating meat simply out of convenience and cost.  To me cooking 10-12 eggs a night would be inconvenient, and costly in my current life.  I find it easier to grill a piece of antibiotic free (vegetable fed) chicken.  Oherwise I follow most of the rules of Ori's diet philosophy.  Here is a rough diet on a good day, in order of consumption durring the day tell me what you think:

- organic Grapefruit
- organic yogurt + probiotic (acidophilus supplement) + multivitamin + maca supplement
- organic almond butter on flourless sprouted bread (the eziekil brand, I think it's gluten free)
- large salad, all organic produce, baby spinach, romaine, carrots, celery, hemp seeds, goji berries, pumpkin seeds
- organic Quinoa, organic lentils or beans, chicken breast
- Tea
- almond+goji berries

Now that's a near perfect day for me, which is rare.  Becuase of my insane career, It's rarely like that unfortunately...

[clake16]

Thanks for the responses.  A couple of things:  I went back to eating meat simply out of convenience and cost.  To me cooking 10-12 eggs a night would be inconvenient, and costly in my current life.  I find it easier to grill a piece of antibiotic free (vegetable fed) chicken.  Oherwise I follow most of the rules of Ori's diet philosophy.  Here is a rough diet on a good day, in order of consumption durring the day tell me what you think:

- organic Grapefruit
- organic yogurt + probiotic (acidophilus supplement) + multivitamin + maca supplement
- organic almond butter on flourless sprouted bread (the eziekil brand, I think it's gluten free)
- large salad, all organic produce, baby spinach, romaine, carrots, celery, hemp seeds, goji berries, pumpkin seeds
- organic Quinoa, organic lentils or beans, chicken breast
- Tea
- almond+goji berries

Now that's a near perfect day for me, which is rare.  Becuase of my insane career, It's rarely like that unfortunately...

I'm not familiar with goji berries, but I assume they're sweet - containing sugar.  If that is the case, it is not recommended to eat those foods in combination with nuts.  Also, the almond butter with bread is not recommended (grains and fats).  But that is in theory.  If you have been doing that and you havent noticed any trouble with how you feel, energy, etc. I would say it's fine.  One thing to keep in mind is that the chemistry/biology of every person is goign to be different.  Take advice from people on here and "play around" with it.  If you systematically add things to your diet in a way that you isolate one new addition at a time and do not have any negative reactions, that will always be your best bet. 

On a side note.  The level you take this diet will be different from everyone else.  You have to incorporate it in a way that you can follow for the rest of your life.  So if you do not do everything 100% by the book, do not stress over it.  Just make the best decisions you can with-in your framework.  Everything you do is better than "nothing".

Here is a quick n dirty overview of food pairings and thing from the AED forum (you can access the links there):

I'd like to address here an issue that has been frequently raised by AEDiet followers. We often receive questions regarding what's allowed and what's not allowed in the AEDiet. People email us and call us with questions such as "are pickles allowed in Phase I of the diet?", "What if I don't like oranges or grapefruit, is there anything else?", or "What other vegetables besides broccoli and cauliflower can I use?"

Allowed Foods:

All vegetables and fruits are allowed in all three phases of the diet (except for diabetics, who should avoid fruits).
    * Fish, eggs and organic dairy are allowed in all phases of the diet (except for individuals who are allergic or sensitive to the above).
    * Nuts and seeds are allowed in Phase II and Phase III of the diet.
    * Meat, chicken, pasta and bread are allowed in Phase III of the diet (except for individuals who are reactive to any of the above or diabetic cases who should refrain from eating bread or pasta until reestablishing healthy blood sugar levels).
    * Coffee and caffeinated teas are allowed in all phases of the diet (except for individuals who are hypertensive).
    * Olive oil is allowed in all phases of the diet, as well as grapeseed and sesame seed oils.
    * Small amounts of maple sugar or rice syrup are allowed (except for diabetics).
    * Small amounts of dark chocolate (80% cacao) are allowed in Phase III (except for diabetics).

Foods to Avoid:

    * Avoid processed soy products (besides fresh soybeans, edamame or small servings of soy sauce and miso).
    * Avoid estrogen promoting spices and herbs including licorice, anise, soy isoflavones and black cohosh.
    * Avoid estrogen promoting vegetable oils such as canola, corn, safflower, and soy.
    * Avoid all sweet baked or fried foods including cookies, cakes, donuts, muffins, scones, candy bars, granola bars and chocolate coated fruits or nuts.
    * Avoid conventional (inorganic) meat and dairy.
    * Avoid soft drinks.
    * Also, avoid diet shakes and bars with artificial sweeteners, sugar alcohol or chemical additives.

"Need to Knows" about Food Combinations

To simplify things here is the most important principle:

    * Vegetables and protein foods combine with everything. This means that all vegetables and all protein foods (i.e. meat, chicken, fish, eggs and dairy) combine with every other food item.

      Note that other food groups – grains, nuts, fruits, sweets and alcohol – can certainly combine with vegetables and protein foods, but cannot combine with each other.

To reiterate:

    * Grains (bread, pasta, rice, etc.) can't combine with nuts, fruits or sweets or alcohol.
    * Nuts (almonds, pecans, walnuts, etc.) can't combine with grains, fruits or sweets.
    * Fruits can't combine with grains, nuts or alcohol.
    * Sweets can't combine with grains, nuts, fruits or alcohol.
    * Alcohol can't combine with anything except for vegetables and protein.

In conclusion, all fruits and vegetables are allowed at any time. All vegetables and protein foods can combine with every other food item. Other food groups, grains, nuts, fruits and alcohol, CANNOT combine with each other.

[Andy S]

Thanks Clark.  I actually read both books, but wasn't aware of the food combination no-no. 

[TheUsurper]

Haha, I suck at making poached eggs as well.  I've heard that it helps to put a little vinegar in the water.  
     For "perfect" soft boiled eggs: I put all my eggs in a pot, then fill up with water with just enough to cover the eggs, or even leave a couple partially exposed.  Then I put the pot on the stove, turn it on high, and set the timer for 10-12 minutes(may vary for different stoves).  I dont remember how I devised this, all I know is that it works haha.  Putting the eggs in right away before the water is heated also prevents cracking.  I usually crack the egg on the "rounder" side instead of on the pointy side and then peel downwards.  I've gotten great results eating primarily just eggs and yogurt as my sources of protein.  I like to vary the veggies moreso than the protein/carb/fat sources.  My staples are eggs, yogurt, almonds, sweet potatoes, olive oil and garlic.  I vary bell peppers, broccoli, brussel sprouts, onions, etc almost every day.  Once a week or so I'll have salmon on a high fat day, or beans/lentils on a high-carb day, but mostly i stick to the soft-boiled eggs, or yogurt sprinkled with cinnamon (high carb day with sweet potato).  I just starting creating a food log next to a training log right now on an excel spreadsheet to track exactly how my results are corresponding to my diet.  And you don't need to be afraid of a dozen eggs being "safe" as far as saturated fats go.  The RDA is like 25g per day and 1 egg is 1.5g so 12 is 18g total; even with a small amount from almonds/olive oil you probably will still be under.  My buddy back home "takes 24 lives a day" as he likes to term it lol.  Happy to help chris,

Andrew

ps-your beans/lentils with a bit of egg in it idea sounds good, just make sure to limit fat consumption on carb days.  I try to aim for no more than 30 on most days, and about 50 on a real high calorie day.  I've been trying to formulate a weekly diet scheme thats manageable and most efficient at burning fat/building muscle.  So far my latest one is this. Mon/Tues-fat, Wed-carb, Thurs/Fri-fat, Sat/Sun-carb.  Most days I have 1900 cals, but on thurs and sunday, I eat as much as I want, which usually comes out to about 3000 cals.  Once I've reached my ideal state for defenition, i'll simply raise the calories on the "low" days to about 2000-2100 to pack on some more size.  It's a combination of the load/deplete idea I was running earlier, how I was eating pre-WD when I reached my best condition ever for wrestling season(team football dinners thursday nights and sunday "cheat" day), and some "new" information I sort of forgot nd remembered- you shouldn't go more than 72 hrs low carb because it reduces the amount of oxaloacetic acid in your system, which improves fat oxidation (at the same time, you want to minimize insulin, which inhibits fat-burning, so it's a tricky situation).  The 2 subsequent carb days on the weekend are for maximizing glycogen re-load. wow, that was a long ps

[Andy S]

See these concepts seem so overwhelming.  I never felt like counting calories and the like was necessary.  I also never heard of carb vs fat days

I also think my environment doesnt help.  I don't think humans were meant to survive nyc winters, and I dont know if I can last through another one

[Rachel421]

andy, hearing the fatigue in your words sounds like listening to myself before i dove in to the wd principles. im still in a honeymoon, stage, strickly following most, but not all the principles, the more weeks go by, the more my body tells me to do what ive already read i should do. i scoffed when i read how much water a person like me should drink, now im guzzling 100oz a day, with relish.   i never thought id need a post workout meal,,,now my body leaves me no choice.   dive in and youll see that so much of you exhaustion is diet related. you can do it andy!